Widower Wednesday: Redefining Relationships
May 4th, 2011 | 62 comments
Just a reminder that there are nine days left to submit your story for consideration in the forthcoming Dating a Widower book. Though I’ve asked for a list of specific stories, you’re free to submit any story that that you think will help women who are dating a widower.
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One of the things I’ve learned over the years is the importance of relationships. In the writing and publishing world it’s amazing how far a good relationship with agents, publishers, editors, and other industry movers and shakers will take authors along the path of publication. It’s just as, if not more important, than being able to write and tell a good story. In the business world often business deals or hiring decisions made simply because of past relationships between two people. Whether the relationship is with family, friends, neighbors, co-workers, acquaintances, or complete strangers, how we treat and interact with people defines who we are and, I believe, will make up a good portion of how we’ll be judged by God in the next life.
Relationships aren’t static. As we grow older and experience life events, we’re forced to make changes that redefine relationships. For example, when I got married the first time, my relationship with my single friends changed. I still maintained the friendships but I ended up spending less time with them (or sometimes taking the wife along) because Krista was the top priority in my life. I had to make similar adjustments to relationships with friends and family when I married Marathon Girl. I never ended or lost any friendships when I got married either time but simply redefined how much time I spent with them.
One of the adjustments widowers have a hard time making is redefining relationships with the in-laws after they become serious with a new woman. At least once a week I’ll get an email from a woman saying she feels like number two because the widower still spends a lot of time with LW’s family or is involved in some annual activities and traditions with that family when she wishes they would start some traditions of their own.
From the emails I receive it seems that widowers who have a hard time adjusting the relationship with the LW’s family are those who were already on good terms with the in-laws when the LW was alive and/or those who grew even closer to the in-laws after their wife died. Often these widowers are oblivious that the amount of time they spend with the LW’s family is problem until the new girlfriend or wife mentions it.
Redefining relationships after a life changing event is tricky and I don’t claim to have done it well in every instance (more on that in a minute). I’m also not going to say how much time a widower who’s remarried or is in a serious relations with someone else should or should not spend with the LW’s family. There are too many factors such as children (if any), geography, and how open the LW’s family is to the new woman that make it difficult to give a definitive answer. However, successfully adjusting relationships involves knowing one’s priorities and communicating with others who may find their relationship changed the most. A widower needs to know which relationship (new wife or GF, or LW’s family) is most important than organize his life and priorities accordingly while being man enough to lovingly let family, friends, and others know how his new life could affect the relationships. The widower also needs to understand that no everyone may be happy with his new priorities so he’ll need to have the courage to stand by what he thinks is important while letting those who are offended know that he values their relationship. It’s a delicate balancing act but one that needs to be done to successfully start a new life with someone else.
All this is probably easier said than done. I know it was easier for me to adjust the relationship with Krista’s family then it is for other widowers. First, there were no living children from my marriage to Krista. Also, for a variety of reasons, I never got along good with Krista’s parents. After our daughter’s funeral, I never spoke to them again. I did maintain relationships with Krista’s brother, her grandmother, and a few other family members but even those have gone by the way side. And I have no one to blame for that other than myself. It been about 18 months since I last spoke (well, emailed actually) Krista’s brother. When I tried to get hold of him last month to invite him to my book party, my attempts (email, phone, etc.) were unsuccessful. He has a new email address and phone number and I don’t have them. (No, he’s not on Facebook or other social media sites.) Though I have no regrets about making Marathon Girl and our family numero uno, I never intended my relationship with Krista’s brother to wither and die.
So to those widowers who have a good relationship with your late wife’s family, please understand that making a new life with someone else is going to require adjusting relationships not only with the LW’s family but with friends and others too. However, if you value these relationships, please do a better balancing act than I did. You won’t be able to please everyone but at least let them know how much they mean to you.
To women who find themselves feeling like number two to the LW’s family, please talk to your widower about this and let him know how you feel while being understanding that these people were part of his previous life and it’s unrealistic to expect him to simply boot them out of his life just because you’re in it.
Finally, Scott, if you’re reading this, please take this post as an apology. If you happen to read this, please send me an email. It’s been a while since we talked. I’d like to catch up.
Entry Filed under: Widower Wednesday
Thanks Ted, you’re right. I either deal, or I don’t. It’s funny b/c I’ve always considered myself to be extremely strong but this just tears at my heart. I’m going to take in everyone’s opinion here. I wish I found this site sooner. You have all been wonderful. This is so much easier to explain to people that have similiar situations going on or have had. Thanks again!!!
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Many of you have started successful, happy relationships shortly after the death of a spouse, proof that it can be done. I am happy for all of you in that camp. The most important factor is how ready the widower is to move on and start anew.
In some cases, the in-laws are supportive, in others, sadly, not.
I do think that early start-overs can bring on additional challenges to a widower relationship, and one is that the late wife’s family might have a harder time accepting it.
One thing that was fortunate in my relationship is that my fiance’s his late wife (who struggled with cancer off and on for 17 years) and her family told him before she died that they hoped he would marry again. A suicide or sudden death doesn’t always allow you such lucky conversations. Knowing this helps me reach beyond my occasional insecurities about being the second wife and feel deep gratitude for the path she paved.
Secondly, there was four years between the late wife’s death and when I came on the scene. By that time, everyone, from his 20-something son, his friends and the late wife’s family, was desperately hoping my fiance would find a new love since he was only 45 when she died. I think they felt guilty that he was alone.
Heather, Annie and anyone else who has had bad juju with the in-laws, I feel for you. And I applaud your resolve to stand up for yourselves (and the kids). Heather, you’ve got lots of good advice from other posters.
Thanks, Abel, for another good topic to discuss.
@Heather- At this point and have thought about your situation some more, I feel like it’s so important to see where your BF stands with his LW’s Family. How does he feel knowing that they are treating you so poorly? Do you think he could talk to them, is he ready for that? I’m getting sick to my stomach here, thinking about how bad you must feel right now. If my BF’s inlaws were treating me like that, I’d sure enough tell him to say something to them. That’s cruel. He needs to stand up for you and your relationship. He needs to tell them that it is HIS decision to be with you. I don’t know these people, and I don’t know you, but you sound a lot like me and I don’t like confrentation and I hate it when people are upset or mad at me. So, this is what I would do:
I would sit down with BF. Tell him how much he means to me. Tell him how happy I am that he chose ME to and then opened up enought to fall in love with me. I would tell him how wonderful HIS family is and how sweet they have been to me. I then would ask him how he felt about how the inlaws were reacting towards me.
Heather, if he’s a man that cares about you and sees your relationship going somewhere, he needs to stand up for you. If he doesn’t have the guts to do that, then he is a coward and doesn’t deserve you. It may upset them for him to say something, but what’s more important….a future with you or a family of hurt people lashing out at the innocent newcomer? Stick with a positive attitude…THEY MAY COME TO THEIR SENSES…eventually. They may learn to love you, even. That’s where I am now in my relationship. Last weekend we all went to a baby shower—TOGETHER. They found out about us last September and I didn’t see them again until this February. It was AWKWARD…they spoke their minds, in a nice way, and told me how they felt that I had betrayed them and their Daugter’s memory (she was one of my best friends from HS). It took everything in me to NOT go off. Then my BF stands up and says, “This is MY decision to move on. I found Tami and I like her and want to see where this goes.” They haven’t said a word negatively about me since.
Your BF’s LW’s family seems to be holding on to him tightly, espically beacuse of the children. I get that, I think everyone can get that. Their mistreating you needs to be addressed, soon. They are going to be in the picture forever…if only for the grandkids. He needs to know what is going on and he needs to talk to them. They are directing their anger, grief, etc towards you and that’s terrible. They really should be ashamed of themselves. If you are a praying woman, PRAY. Pray for strength because this time, dealing with the inlaws, is difficult, trust me. It’s been a little over a year since she died and they are just now starting to come around.
They are great people and were devistated when their daughter died so unexpectedly. As far as I know, they haven’t said a bad thing about me, but like i said earlier, they ignored me for MONTHS and it was eating me up inside. Finally I said something to my BF and he talked to them and set up our dinner meeting in February.
COMMINICATION IS KEY!!!! I can’t say it enough, Abel can’t say it enough, Annie can’t say it enough, as well as people that have had SUCCESS with dating in general. This is with a widower or with a man that’s never been married. This is the way to success with any relationship.
I feel for you, Heather, and if you want to talk about this some more via email, I give Abel my permission to give you my email address. This weekend is the 1 year mark from when my BF and I first kissed and this year has been a roller coaster of things. I’d love to talk to you more about this. Keep your head held high, be humble and kind. Think positivly and you will be amazed at how wonderful life can be!
Thank you Tami. I’m at work right now, so I can’t really get to into emailing…especially at this moment, b/c I’m kind of crying, lol. It’s really nice to have people that you don’t even know stick up for you and want to be there for you. Thank you so much!! My BF has talked to them, but they are just…I don’t even know the words for them. There is alot of mental issues with LWs family. They are all on medication, and were well before LW past. She too was highly medicated. At first, we kept our relationship very quiet. One, b/c we weren’t sure where it was going to go so why upset anyone and second b/c he really didn’t know how to bring it up to them. We wanted to make sure it was what we both wanted before we went telling everyone about us. He was just told recently that MIL had LWs best friend do a drive by and that’s how they found out he was seeing someone. I told my Mom “If you find me in a ditch somewhere, you know who to ask first”…these people aren’t very sane. My BF was never really close to them but when LW died, they wanted to take control of the boys…told him to sell the house, move in with them, etc. He said no…but they are constantly saying they want the boys to live with them and go to school in their town b/c they are afraid that someone will tell them what really happened to their Mom. But then, they are the one’s who take them to the cemetery every time they have them, they do these walks for people that died and always want the boys to go…my BF doens’t find that healthy for them and doesn’t let them go. I really don’t think being at the in laws period is healthy for these kids, but I would never say that out loud. My BF really wants to minimize their time with the in laws but doesn’t want to hurt them more then they’ve already been hurt. I just think it’s going to be a long road for us, either way. I mean, dating a widower is tough in itself…add crazy inlaws to the mix and you got yourself a Lifetime movie.
Can someone please break down all the abbreviations for me? Thanks in advance!! I know W is Widower, LW is late wife…but GOW? and some others, I don’t have a clue.
@Heather,
I’d love to chat with ya!
GOW- Girlfriend of widower
BF-boyfriend
MIL-mother in law
IMO-in my opinion
FB- FaceBook
Those are the ones I’m able to decipher! haha
Feel free to email me whenever once Abel gives it to you. I , too, was so lucky to find this website. I had been with my BF for only 4 months when I ran across this site and I’ve been a super fan ever since!
Re: Suicide
Suicide brings with it some extra pain mostly caused by the unanswered questions, hurt feelings, etc. However, I don’t think that should serve as an excuse for bad behavior. To me, Heather, it sounds like the family isn’t to the stage where they’re ready to see the W with another woman..
There was a lot of pain and anger from my family and hers after my LW killed herself–however everyone was generally supportive of me remarrying 15 months after her death. Just because one person makes a stupid decision, doesn’t mean everyone has to act like jerks.
If her family’s harassment is to much, you might want to consider a break for a bit.
Thanks Abel. I’m going to try my hardest to not let it become too much. I really am in love with him and I feel as though I have put alot of time, effort and love toward this whole relationship, too much to just give up on us because of them. I think they feel guilty and I’m sure the in laws feel like they could have done something different to help LW, something other then medicine. They blame W, just as much as they blame themselves. In reallity…there’s no one to blame. Unfortunately, beyond anything I’d ever understand, LW took her OWN life…my BF didn’t do it to her, her family didn’t do it to her and I certainly didn’t do it.
Hey Tami, just chatted with Abel. He said he sent you my email. Feel free to email me anytime. Always up for making new friends
@ Heather, your BF sounds like a wonderful man and he seems to recognize that the IL’s shouldn’t have too much contact with his children b/c of their behavior. It also sounds though like there might have been issues before the LW’s death that could be influencing.
The behavior you are telling us about though is beyond grief’s boundaries. They are actively harassing you. On FB you can report people who use posts or messages to harass you. You can also hide yourself from public search and limit access to your page to just those you know. You can change your email (and if they are coming to you via a work site – tell your employer b/c they might be able to block the ISP).
If you are being stalked, that’s a matter for the police. Really.
As Abel mentioned, taking a break is something to consider. These ppl are obviously using you to get at the BF the same way they are using his kids. Personally, I would simply cut them off. There is no way I would allow anyone to do this to my child or my SO (Significant Other) and as I stated earlier, this is really for your BF to handle b/c this is an issue that they have w/him. You and his children are just the means by which they are attacking.
This is not something likely to blow over with time, imo unless lines are drawn and enforced – by your BF.
Don’t be hard on yourself. You did nothing wrong. I am very sorry that you are being hurt.
Thank you, thank you, thank you! You are all so wonderful!!! I deleted my old FB acct about a month ago, just made a new one this week and blocked all the ppl that are involved with LW. I blocked the brother in law from my phone. W’s oldest has a baseball game tonight, so I may see the in laws. I’ll let ya know how that works out. Eeek.
@Heather – I strongly second everything that Annie just said. This sounds potentially dangerous – they have threatened you. And, even more in my book, they are harming children who have no defense. You and your BF are at least adults and have some ability to protect yourselves. As their father your BF has to keep them safe and healthy, emotionally and physically. As your partner, he also has to put your welfare in front of the desire not to further hurt people who are grieving. Grief is no excuse for what they are doing. I think Annie is right, this is not going to blow over because these are not normal grief reactions. Don’t make excuses for them. Take care of yourself.
Thanks Lynn. Although my BF has been wonderful…you’re right, he needs to be a bit more vocal, I guess. His sisters have told me that he lets the inlaws pretty much do whatever b/c he feels guilty. I’m going to have to build up some courage here. I know I can do it, I just feel bad. I feel like maybe my feelings shouldn’t be so important right now, he’s the one who lost his wife, the inlaws lost their daughter and the boys lost their Mom…although somewhere in me I know I should be treated as #1. Which I can’t really complain, b/c he has treated me wonderfully. There are a few pics in his house, obviously there’s small children involved I don’t expect him to take them down. He wears her wedding ring around his neck which is kind of awkward when we’re being intimate. Ugh, God…I didn’t really realize how much bothered me until now.
@Heather, just one more thing – a caution – it’s wonderful to find others in similar situations that can relate to your own and offer their experience, however, everything should be weighed against your own feelings b/c you are the one who knows the situation best. I only mention this b/c you last sentence “…I didn’t really realize how much bothered me until now.” might indicate that it was really just the IL situation that bothered you until we “helpful” strangers (‘cuz we are and virtual besides) started sharing. No one here is a professional or has the definitive answer – just opinions ( and you know what they say about those). You and your BF have handled things so far and there is no reason to believe that you won’t continue to do that.
Enjoy the baseball game.
Heather…..take care of yourself. This fellow may be ‘the one’ for you, but I see red flags. His ‘out’ laws have issues it would appear, with or without being nasty about a new woman in the W’s life. Your W has been pushed around by the ‘out’ laws to the point of an intervening discussion being raised by his sister….and last but not least, he has that damned wedding ring on a chain around his neck. Abel wore his ring around his neck for a time…but when it became clear that M.G. was the one for him, he took it off. Me? I kissed my wedding ring goodbye, literally, taking it off and slipping it into a corner of my jewelry box the day before I went out on my first serious date post LW. Now it is in a safe-deposit box at the bank for perhaps future use by one of my sons. Point of this? You need to be sure that you are getting definite signs that YOU are number one….and sooner better than later. This guy needs to ‘man’ up, IMO….stomp his foot in front of the outlaws and let them know he will be asking them to get off his boat if they don’t change behavior…and he himself needs to change behavior. Can’t understand why any man would expect a woman to be intimate with the LW’s ring jangling around his neck. But these are just my opinions based on my experience and how I processed my return to life and love after LW’s death.
Sorry for the triple post. I was using my daughter’s Apple and it doesn’t like me. I am a PC guy.
Cleaned them up, Ted. I’m a PC guy too.
Thanks Abel, for a thoughtful, well written article. For me it’s not inlaw, ‘outlaws,’ or children, but friends of LW who my BF and LW socialized with. I discovered many were friends of LW before my BF came along. Some seem ok with me, but others have not ‘warmed up over the months.’ My BF is planning a dinner party next week and wants to invite many of these folks along. While I don’t think he should have to give up friends because of me… I think the event will be telling. I dread the thought of the topic of LW coming up, but if it does, that will tell me something. I’ll hope that he will be able to ‘let go’ of some of these relationships, or that they won’t be as prominent and that we will define our own social life. This evening he got an invitation to have dinner with perhaps ‘ther’ closest friends (they’d gotten together every week) and I suggested he go alone. Again thanks once again for clearly putting words to what I’ve been feeling…
Ted, ya think you could give my BF a firm talking to you? Ha! No, he’s really great, I can’t complain too much. But thank you for your opinion. I actually wrote down all the things that have been bothering me, the picture in the bedroom…I am just going to ask him to put it on his side of the bed, on the night stand…instead of the dresser that’s directly in front of the bed and I’m going to ask for him to either remove the necklace during our times of intimacy or turn it around. I don’t want to force him to get rid of things or put them away if he’s not ready.
@Carol, I think it’s ridiculous that anybody should treat you with contempt because you’re with your bf. I always say to my man that anyone who genuinely cares about him would be delighted for him that he’s happy again after all the times of sadness he’s been through when his LW was ill and after she died. It’s so difficult for anyone to find someone special that they have lots in common with, who makes them laugh and brings lots of happiness to their life so his friends should be thankful that he has found you.
@Heather, it can be difficult to know how to approach the subject of photos of LW. You would kind of hope that he’d realise himself that it’s not the best idea having a photo in the bedroom that catches your eye during intimate moments! For some W’s though it’s all very black and white as in “LW’s gone, I’m here with you now so what’s the problem”. As for the ring on the necklace I would def have a problem with that too and would find it difficult not to mention it.
Yea I don’t think he even realized that it would bother. And he’s certianly not a mind reader. But do you think it’s too soon to bring up the ring thing? We’ve been dating for 4 months, but its really not your typical 4 month dating…we moved pretty fast. Tried not to, but it sort of just happened.
Ok, so I’ve decided to not bring up the ring or pictures, yet anyway. I think maybe I should just hold off and see if he does it on his own. I don’t want to make him feel bad or I don’t want him to feel like he HAS to do something that he really doesn’t want to do. Thanks for all your help, I really appreicate it!!!
Heather….You can wait if you wish, but don’t wait too long. Some W’s begin to see (or perhaps better phrase would be ‘not see’) LW things like a photo in the bedroom, as just wallpaper. They are there for sure, but YOU notice them, and HE doesn’t. IMO you need to give him a gentle, “non-bitching” comment as to how any LW things make you feel, especially in the bedroom and especially is you are intmate. It is one thing to tolerate LW photos and happy memories of a past life for the sake of kids in the house. Quite another to expect a new woman to take all of it in and not speak up.
@Heather – Your feelings are just as important as his are. If he is ready to have a relationship with you that includes being intimate, he should be ready to remove her ring. You need to tell him how you feel about it. You don’t have to demand that he remove it but you do need to be clear. And, while you are at it, I would mention the picture in the bedroom. His LW is not going to be hurt if he moves the picture to a guest room or someplace out of the bedroom. Odds are that he really doesn’t have a clue it bothers you. I felt very hesitant to bring things up with my W at first but found that once he was aware that something bothered me, he’d change it. Only once did I have to ask him to take something down; a huge, framed certificate signed by all of their wedding guests which hung in the entrance way to his home where I saw it every time I entered the house or walked to the dining room. He took it down and put it away. As he says, I am his priority and it is important to him that he do everything to make our relationship the best it can be. It doesn’t mean that he didn’t love his LW or that he doesn’t have many wonderful memories of their 30 years together, just that she is gone and I am here. As many people who follow (and write) this blog say, being widowed does not give anyone a pass to treat another badly. Good luck!
@heather , IMHO, he is not ready to be with you if he keeps his ring around his neck and still has pictures up in his bedroom. I feel it is still a way for him to feel close to the LW. I brought the subject up to my W. He told me that it was his room also. He told me she is daed and said she is not a threat to me, even though I felt otherwise. I was so hurt. I feel he’s still hanging on. I used to tell my W constantly that actions speak louder than words. I’m happy that your W didn’t consider putting the funeral guestbook under a glass, lighted, as mine did.
There will always be comments by those who have their own issues. We had been married for 18+ years when step-daughter, who had been my daughter since she was four, married. My DH’s sister–not LW’s sister– came to us in the wedding line and informed me that she only came because she loved LW. I just smiled and said,” Well, we’re just glad you came.” (One of the few times in my life that a good one-liner came to mind instantly.) Her son and daughter-in-law, who were with her heard and apologized profusely, as did my DH. I have always wondered what I did to bring that on. (LW’s sister just cried hysterically during the entire ceremony because LW was not there.–Not much I could do about that, either.)
I guess if I have a thought about the above posts, it would be that perhaps sex should wait until after the issues of rings, pictures, etc. are long settled. From my perspective–and I’m sure this will not be well accepted on this site–that kind of intimacy is saved for husbands, not boy friends. If W is getting all he wants in the bedroom while still wallowing in grief, memories, etc., it would seem there is no incentive to change anything. He already has the best of both worlds. On the other hand, I would not want pictures of my previous spouse–late or otherwise– around during any moments that I am with another man–intimately or otherwise. That is just creepy.
Heather: When I started dating my fiance, there were three widower issues that bothered me a great deal:
1. the photo of his late wife in bedroom of his weekend house (the one he and late wife used to live — he works and we live together in a different town).
2. the way he habitually said “my wife” instead of “my late wife” (both when we were alone and with other people).
3. the memorial tattoo over his heart with late wife’s name.
I told him how uncomfortable all three things made me. He was clueless (as Ted says, this stuff was ‘wallpaper’ to him) but as soon as I told him, he understood.
In the first case, I stopped visiting him at the weekend house until he put the bedroom photos away a few weeks later (I was fine with other photos in the house as his adult son still lives there).
In the second, I gently and discreetly reminded him to add the “late” every time he said “my wife.” This took several months to develop his new habit, but eventually he did.
With the tattoo, he did not offer to remove it, nor did I expect him to, but he understand why it hurt me. I decided that because he was really as great a fiance/future husband as I could have in all other respects, I would learn to make peace with it and have done so. Now, it is more or less like wallpaper to me. (Abel already had this as a discussion topic several weeks ago).
Luckily, these were the only widower baggage we had to deal with.
But the most important thing was not that we avoided all conflict, but that we were able to talk about it openly, and that he actually cared how I felt (and visa versa). Here was a guy who would not shy away from tough topics and would stay the course.
My fiance has expressed his gratitude and acknowledged that our relationship would never have left the runway had we not dealt with the widower stuff head on, sooner rather than later.
I highly doubt that moving the bedroom photo to another part of the room or waiting for your BF to take the ring off on his own will quell your worries for long. I along with others here urge you to tell him how they make you feel.
Give him gentle reminders/encouragement to make the changes you need to feel comfortable, and set a deadline for yourself. If he doesn’t do so in a reasonable amount of time, I’d strongly recommend you cut bait and find a man who will love you without the snags.
Diney: I don’t disagree with you, that in a more perfect world, we’d solve these widower issues before sexual intimacy. But life isn’t always perfect, and most of us (myself included) don’t make the best choices 100 percent of the time. Thanks for sharing your point of view.
As we talk about redefining relationships, this question occurs to me: Does anyone know if legally or technically, the death of a spouse puts the in-laws in the ex- or former category?
Karen M, I don’t how MIss Manners would rule on the ex or former but I’ve noticed that many non-widowed seem to feel that in-laws become become one or the other. Most widowed, however, don’t categorize them that way and some are even offended by this because it seems to equate death with divorce and the widowed often bristle at the idea that they are the same thing. Although I don’t care for my late husband’s family, they are still my in-laws. His death didn’t nullify our connection – unfortunately. My husband is still very much a part of his late wife’s family and not just b/c of his children, and they consider him family too. Who your family is sometimes goes beyond the technically legal and whether or not in-laws stay a part of the scene depends a lot on the relationships developed and whether there are children involved. Just my take, for what it is worth.
What happens when the LW has been gone for almost 7yrs and your relationship with the W has been the last 3yrs and you still feel you are competing with LW. He still gets very emotional about her, and today for mothers day he brings the kids out to her grave for flowers (which i dont have problem with) but ive been here for the last 3yrs (not married) and i got nothing. how can i be number 1 and you want me to step in the roll of being mom but doesnt even acknowledge me on this day.
planning a vacation he wants to go back to a place they stayed because it was so peaceful and the beach was so nice, and he just wants to recreate that for him and his kids, so they can go to a place where their mom and him once was. well im sorry but he lives in the house they had so why recreate a memory???
someone please tell me that im wrong, but im pretty sure he is still holding on to his LW and can not move on.
Heather~I agree with Ted’s posts here. You are in a no win situation. The outlaws will always be iin the picture no matter what. Rings, photos, mean outlaws=TROUBLE. I’m sure the W is a terrific person, but he needs to keep the outlaws under control or back away from them and get his widowed act together….In my case dating a W for 5 1/2 years, the outlaws told him IN THE CEMETARY that he shouldn’t even think of dating for at least 2 years. Who does that? Controlling outlaws do, that’s who. Apparently, the LW and the W were like puppets around her parents. When she passed, they expected the same dynamics to occur w/the W. I had no problem at all with him continuing a relationship with the inlaws, however, they snubbed me many times, tried to set the W up with other women, purposely didn’t invite me to a 50th surprise birthday party, put extra photos up of the LW if I would be around, etc. They were passive agressive. There were never any spoken words. In the beginning, the W was very supportive of me. I was thrilled. I thought we could have a wonderful life together.Then, over time, the outlaws wouldn’t stop. When I complained, I became “the complainer’. The outlaws lived about 4 miles away ~too close for comfort. Needless to say, I had to finally walk away from all the widowed nonsense. My only regret is that I didn’t do it sooner. Learn from my mistakes. Listen seriously to what people are posting here. Your situation is more outwardly hostile. This will not get better. Live, learn, and move on. If the W can’t take a FIRM stand, you two are doomed. He has to have your back 800%. This constant tug of war is not worth it. I am so happy to have the mean, nasty outlaws out of my life. I never dreamed people could be so mean, but they are and will continue to be that way. Good luck. There is someone better suited for you out there.
Another point, Heather~The pictures in the bedroom and wearing a ring are part of not letting go. Would you tolerate that from a divorced man? I wouldn’t and you shouldn’t in w/the W ether. I’m thinking the W is way involved too soon before he has emotionally grieved and you are just filling the void like my W did, sorry to say.
@Tonya, it sounds as though him and his children want you to be part of their lives when it suits them and then just make yourself scarce when you’re not needed such as mothers day. That’s insensitive of him. I’m sure that a little gesture of thanks for all that you do would have been appreciated. As for the holiday, he seems to be in some kind of fantasy world where he can recreate what they had when she was there. For his children’s sake it would help them far more if they could see him moving on and trying to create new memories instead of recreating old ones. Although I’m much older than his kids my dad died a year and half ago and as much as i loved him i would think it v unhealthy if my mum suggested we should all go to somewhere we went with him and recreate a memory!!
@Heather, did you say how long ago your bf’s LW died or did I miss that in one of earlier posts?
Tonya, you don’t mention how old the kids are but if they are teens/young adults, it will take time to build relationships and though they can be wonderful, you won’t be their mom. I have two grown step-daughters and we have always gotten on well but it’s only within the last year that we’ve really begun to be closer. I received Mom’s day wishes from them both and flowers, which I truly appreciate but I don’t expect. Children, whatever their age, will come to you in there own way and time. Even with younger kids though it takes time. My daughter was 4 when we married and it was about two years later that she began to call R “Dad” and she never even knew her own father, so it wasn’t like R had much to compete with. If you feel though that this isn’t a case of just needing time and that you are being looked at as a replacement perhaps you should air your feelings. It isn’t doing you any good to keep them bottled up and if he is not on the same page as you are or unwilling to be, you should know and make your plans according to what is best for you. It would bother me if R’s LW was considered the model I was to live up to, but that’s never been the case and even though we live in the house they shared and have a timeshare (that we are heading to soon) that was theirs – I have never felt like R was trying recreate anything. We’ve created a home that is ours and our time together – wherever – is new b/c it is us. Communication is key. Good luck.
@diney I don’t disagree with you either.
@Tonya — Why have you put up with this for three years?
@Abel, since it’s been brought up and 2nd’d/3rd’d, there is a difference btwn being someone’s wife and his girlfriend – in his eyes, family’s and children’s. Perhaps the issue isn’t widow related at all but simply the fact that it’s not the same thing. No matter how far we think we have come as a society, the old pov’s don’t change – not really.
I recently started dating a widower about 6 months ago. His adult daughters don’t like the idea at all. I won’t go into detail to protect the guilty, but the rudeness is a whole new level for me. It isn’t me, because they don’t know me. I googled this issue and discovered it is a huge problem. All I can say is, OMG, what am I getting myself into?
My father died several years ago, so I understand the death of a parent. I was just shocked because I never would have dreamed of 1) interfering in my mom’s life or 2) treating someone like that. If I treated a man my mom was dating with such rudeness, I swear my dad would rise from his grave and let me know I was not too old for a good old fashioned spanking. We kids were never allowed to behave like that under any circumstances. It didn’t matter the reason…we just didn’t do stuff like that EVER. No excuses.
In starting to research this subject, I noticed all these sites for women dating widowers, but I didn’t really see any for men dating widows. Is that because widows generally wait so long to start dating that their kids are thrilled to finally see them move on? Or is it because guys don’t give a crap about what the kids/family think or say about them, so no need for online therapy? Just curious.
@Molly, My step-daughters were a bit upset at first but never anything but kind and polite to me. I think that kids who act up have probably been given too much input into family decisions that should have been the realm of the parents alone and so feel free to continue after one parent has died, jmo.
I am widowed myself and would say that widows and widowers are about the same in terms of some moving on quickly and others waiting. Reasons vary but mostly it is personality and experience that dictates this. Women though are more likely to poll the internet for advice than men simply b/c society thinks that it’s okay for women to overthink relationships but isn’t as tolerant of men doing that. It’s an antique gender thing that applies to dating in general. I have also noted that on the widow sites, widows who are dating agonize or many of the same things – committment, rude children, mixed signals, etc.
I am sorry that you are being treated badly by your BF’s grown children. You shouldn’t have to tolerate that b/c there is no good excuse for it. It is, however, something that your BF has to put his foot down on and if he doesn’t, that says a lot. Good luck to you.
@Annie (#48) — Agreed. In my mind there’s a difference.
@Molly — I agree w/ Annie. It’s up to the W to put his foot down. As for the men dating widows site, I think it’s just a differnece in the way men and women treat issues. Men many read the sites but then go off and do their own thing anyway. Most don’t need (or think they don’t need) the support.
@Molly. Regarding why there seems to be no active site for men (widowers) seeking advice to their problems dating again and/or being rejected, for example, by a widow’s kids and family: We all know men rarely stop and ask for directions. Plus, I honestly think that many men (W or otherwise) confronted with the rejections and rude behavior from the late husband kids and family trying to sabotage the relationship simply move on. It is hard to say, but as a man, if I were confronted with the flip-side by some of the terribly hurtful issues you women sometimes encounter dating a W, I might move on. I know for a fact based on my two serious relationships and even casual dating via computer matching before I hit upon the magic of my Perfect Gal, that it is very easy for a W to appear to be a hero-good guy type in this vast sea of divorced women. So why put up with crap, I think, Molly, would be most men’s take. And they simply move on. My hat is off to you ladies who persevere and really work at the relationship with a W when it becomes a issue ridden. I just don’t think that tenacious feature is in a lot of men. For me personally what I have said above is theoretical as I have never dated a widow nor have I encountered any bad manners at all from P.G.’s kids.
@Tonya I’m in a similar situation. We have been living together for 2 1/2 years and are recently engaged. The kids 14 and 17 got flowers and took them to their Mom’s grave, which I’m totally supportive of, but I didn’t even hear Happy Mothers Day. I was a little hurt by the lack of appreciation. My kids got flowers for me on saturday and invited one of his kids to help pick them out, but she declined saying she would get flowers for her Mom tomorrow. When I mentioned something to the W about it feeling like it was just another day he said he didn’t plan anything big because I had to work. I would have been happy with a Happy Mothers Day though.
@Amy, I’m sorry the day didn’t turn out as you hoped. My husband helped our daughter (he’s the only father she knows as she was so small when her dad died) do the Mother’s Day thing, and my step-daughters sent me FB wishes and the older one brought flowers when she and her BF came to dinner that evening. However, the first couple of Mother’s Day, they didn’t acknowledge me. I am not their mother after all and I am sure there is conflict for them regarding the day and me. Perfectly normal. It takes time to build relationships and technically you are not even their step-mother yet even if you are acting the “mom” role. If being acknowledged is important to you, perhaps you should simply tell your W so next year he will know.
@Ted, it’s not tenaciousness. It’s the way girls are raised to equate the degree of difficulty with the worth of the relationship. All that “the course of true love never did run smooth” nonsense. There are always little things, as Abel points out in his most recent post, but drama should be an integral part, imo.
Dangit, mean to say “drama should NOT be an integral part”.
@Annie, I agree… in addition, I think most girls are either raised or socialized to make their relationships (and esp romantic ones) the central aspect of their lives…. which in turn leads to a hyper-focus on making them work, despite whether or not said relationship may be meeting their needs or be healthy for them. It’s been my experience that men tend to be a bit more “well rounded” (not sure if that’s the right word)… they have lives that focus on a variety of things, with their romantic ties often being one of several important things in their lives. Makes it easier to be practical when something’s not working … or becomes too difficult, too much. Just my observations from many years of dating (and a host of my own errors!)
Happy Friday everyone!
I met my W 2 1/2 years after his LW death. The year we met we went to his Mother’s house for Christmas. However, after that we did not spend holidays together because he had to go to his parents’ house plus his LW’s house for the holidays, he hadn’t any time for me or my family. I felt so left out and he did not understand (we were in a serious relationship, I thought, at the time) that he should spend time with my family, also. I ended up breaking up with him because I did not feel that it was right that I had to attend my family’s holidays alone. I felt as if I were dating a married man.
I’m a W whose wife died two years ago leaving me to bring up our two children aged 6 and 3. Somehow I managed to find a way through the fog that my grief had surrounded me with. My wife’s father had not featured that much in our lives during our fifteen years together. Her father left the marital home when my LW was five years old and he moved abroad a few years later. In recent years he would visit us once/twice a year with his wife(LW’s stepmum). He was responsible for many bitter family conflicts over the fifteen years but until recently I was not involved in any of these. My LW used to frequently ask me to tell him she was out when he called because he is a difficult person to talk to.
He came to stay last Christmas with his wife and it was a disaster. They criticised the way I was bringing up my children and were generally negative about everything. My children are happy, well balanced individuals. His wife told me how bossy my daughter(5) was and how great she could be with the correct guidance. She offered to take her back home overseas and raise her for me indicating she could do a better job! We had a minor argument based on their comments and I told them that I was doing a fantastic job and felt proud of myself. Next evening she said I should take my daughter for tests asap to find out if she carries the same cancerous gene that her mother had and that she has a 50% chance of dying from it(breast cancer). It’s something I know I will deal with later on but have been advised that it’s not necessary yet since she’s only 5. I felt strongly that I should let my daughter have her childhood then look into when she’s older. His wife told me in a very matter of fact way it was best to know so we could prepare her for a double mastectomy when she was older. I was shocked, upset and angry with her insensitivity. I was also v concerned that my son or daughter might overhear these comments as it might cause them to worry and they’re too young to understand the enormity of such a thing. The following morning after getting very little sleep, I asked LW’s father and his wife to leave.
A few months had passed and I received an angry message on my answer phone from LW’s dad. He told me that he intended to see his daughters children whether I like it or not. I sent him an email explaining why I was upset and angry with him but I had no intention of stopping him from seeing his grandchildren. He then replied accusing me of child abuse and recounted an incident where I had picked my daughter up and carried her upstairs when she refused to go to bed one evening. He also said that my wife’s trust in me to do a good job raising the children was misplaced mainly based on his belief that I hadn’t fulfilled her wishes for the funeral that she wanted. All of this was utter rubbish! His email was full of negativity and condescending remarks towards me. His final comment upset me the most that it must be nice for me living in the house that was made available to me free of debt by his daughter’s death.
During our exchange of emails I had constantly asked him to change his attitude toward me but his accusatory insults just got worse. I finally decided to cut him out of our lives due to all of the upset and anger he had caused. I believe that his guilt for being absent during many years of his daughter’s life was a main factor for his anger and disrespect towards me.
I loved my wife very much and I always will. The children have got me through the darkest days and kept me focused. We feel each other’s love and it keeps us secure and strong. LW’s father seems unable to see this. I am very disappointed that I have had to resort to making such a dramatic decision. I wish that he could see how happy his daughter’s children are and how far we have come on our journey without their mum. Months of bedtime crying, asking for mummy and wanting to know when she was coming back, dealing with the burden of their grief as well as my own but we got through it together. I think it is important to include LW’s family in my children’s life but only if they are a positive influence for the children.
Larry, I think you hit the target when you said that her father was projecting his guilt on you. The LW family of my W were thinking of suing for custody of his kids and scheming about ways to do it. Fortunately they didn’t have any evidence that would compell the courts to take his children away from him after they already lost their other parent. It’s amazing how grief and/or hard times exposes the character of people. Lots of venom are the result of unresolved guilt from those who are not strong enough to admit their failures.
My BFs in-laws have been surprisingly acepting of me. Which I was expecting the cold shoulder. But was relatively painless. He has younger children who like to see their grandparents so I’m glad they are accepting. And on Memorial Day went to the cemetary with the BF who I told if he wanted to be alone that I was quite ok with not going with. He said he was fine with me going. I think I felt kinda strange going with him. But all went ok.
Dear All, I would like your help with this one. My BF mother keeps calling me by LW name, I say it’s ok and try to make the atmosphere comfortable, but it’s getting me down. 18 months on and LW family don’t even know about me, apparently I have never come up! Bf has no children so doesn’t have a lot of contact. LW and I shared some mutual friends, they are the ones I have had the most trouble with, they haven’t supported us, in face they posted pictures of LW in her wedding dress on their face book profiles knowing I would see them. They make comments how they miss her etc. BF was married only eight weeks before she passed, together for nine years. The photos of her only appeared once he was open about his relationship with me. BF has cut some of the ties and we don’t do group thing now as I just felt like a replacement, but he does seem to want to continue with these friendships but I find it very difficult being surrounded at most social events by LW’s three best friends. Any thoughts or advice would be extremely welcomed.
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